BRM Reviews the 8/1/2011 Raw

[Big Red Machine]

PUNK-TRIPLE H SEGMENT- AWESOME! One thing that they did that I really liked was that they gave a reason for Punk coming back so soon.

DIVAS BATTLE ROYALE- 4/10. Yawn. Nothing we haven’t seen 90 times before, and hurt a lot by the lack of attention paid to it by the announcers
AFTERMATH- ABOUT TIME! Beth Phoenix finally makes the heel turn she should have made two years ago.

MIZ & R-TRUTH SEGMENT- dumb. R-Truth can’t spell now? Whose idea of humor is that?

R-TRUTH & THE MIZ vs. JOHN MORRISON & REY MYSTERIO- 6/10

DOLPH, VICKIE, & RILEY SEGMENT- eh.

OTUNGA & MCGILLICUTTY vs. SANTINO & ZACK RYDER- 3/10

ALBERTO DEL RIO vs. EVAN BOURNE- 4.75/10

CLOSING SEGMENT- very good. The Johnny Ace thing was a nice twist.

Overall, Raw was very disappointing in the ring, but the Punk-Triple H-Cena stuff was made it watchable.

[badnewzxl]

Again, I liked the Truth stuff; they're just being silly.

If HHH and Punk are gonna be at odds like this for a while, I WON'T miss RAW EVER AGAIN! They were solid. Cena kinda got humbled, and I think it hurt him in a way. HHH pretty much just sonned him; telling him not to call him Hunter. He needs to turn heel or develop a real mean streak bc he is SO stale. Even when he threatened Ace he didn't seem threatening at all.

And how does Cena have a legit claim to the title? Not only was he beaten for the title fair and square BY THE OTHER CHAMPION, but he "reclaimed" the title by beating a guy who'd had a match earlier in the night.

[Big Red Machine]

Again, I liked the Truth stuff; they're just being silly.

If HHH and Punk are gonna be at odds like this for a while, I WON'T miss RAW EVER AGAIN! They were solid. Cena kinda got humbled, and I think it hurt him in a way. HHH pretty much just sonned him; telling him not to call him Hunter. He needs to turn heel or develop a real mean streak bc he is SO stale. Even when he threatened Ace he didn't seem threatening at all.

And how does Cena have a legit claim to the title? Not only was he beaten for the title fair and square BY THE OTHER CHAMPION, but he "reclaimed" the title by beating a guy who'd had a match earlier in the night.

Cena's claim to the title is the following: Him doing the right thing cost him the title (after all, he could have just let Vince screw Punk and he would have retained the belt). Also, with Punk not in the company anymore, Cena couldn't have gotten his rematch. Therefore, Cena deserved a title shot, which he got, and won the belt. Rey agreed to having the match that night. That isn't Cena's fault (just like it isn't Punk's fault that Cena didn't accept Vince's help).

[kiel297]

Again, I liked the Truth stuff; they're just being silly.

If HHH and Punk are gonna be at odds like this for a while, I WON'T miss RAW EVER AGAIN! They were solid. Cena kinda got humbled, and I think it hurt him in a way. HHH pretty much just sonned him; telling him not to call him Hunter. He needs to turn heel or develop a real mean streak bc he is SO stale. Even when he threatened Ace he didn't seem threatening at all.

And how does Cena have a legit claim to the title? Not only was he beaten for the title fair and square BY THE OTHER CHAMPION, but he "reclaimed" the title by beating a guy who'd had a match earlier in the night.

Cena's claim to the title is the following: Him doing the right thing cost him the title (after all, he could have just let Vince screw Punk and he would have retained the belt). Also, with Punk not in the company anymore, Cena couldn't have gotten his rematch. Therefore, Cena deserved a title shot, which he got, and won the belt. Rey agreed to having the match that night. That isn't Cena's fault (just like it isn't Punk's fault that Cena didn't accept Vince's help).

THANK YOU!!!!!!11!!!!1!!!!

I keep seeing post after post after post all over the freaking internet bitching about how "if Cena's so honourable, then why hasn't he refused to accept the WWE championship if he knows CM Punk is the true champion! Creative you idiots! Y U NO LISTEN TO MY ARMCHAIR BOOKING?!"

Why should John Cena refuse to accept a championship that he's won legitimately?! The night after Money In The Bank, Vince McMahon stripped CM Punk of the WWE Championship. It was well within his power to do so. He also made the championship tournament to crown a new champion, ALSO within his power.

So Rey Mysterio wins a VACANT championship and is therefore the rightful champion, no matter how much the CM Punk marks want to say otherwise. Later that night John Cena beats Rey Mysterio for the WWE Championship. John Cena is the rightful champion.

Now, let's throw CM Punk and Triple H into the mix. CM Punk is no longer champion as of July 18th, due to Vince McMahon stripping him of the title. Now, Triple H, the new COO, doesn't like the way Vince handled this, and it's quite clear. According to an interview CM Punk gave on a breakfast show yesterday (Monday August 1st), the kayfabe stance is that CM Punk apparently turned up at RAW during the John Cena/Rey Mysterio match, signed the contract and said hit my music.

Seeing as Triple H disagreed with Punk being stripped of the title, he made it clear at Comic Con that Punk would be champ if he came back. But he couldn't just cancel the championship tournament, and there's no way that Triple H could have gone out first and told both Rey and John that neither of them were the rightful champion, as CM Punk has returned. So he did the only thing he could do. He accepted that both CM Punk and John Cena have legitimate claim to the WWE Championship, and made a WWE Championship match between the two at Summerslam...

WHERE DOES THIS NOT MAKE SENSE? I FIND IT BRILLIANT.

[badnewzxl]

Again, I liked the Truth stuff; they're just being silly.

If HHH and Punk are gonna be at odds like this for a while, I WON'T miss RAW EVER AGAIN! They were solid. Cena kinda got humbled, and I think it hurt him in a way. HHH pretty much just sonned him; telling him not to call him Hunter. He needs to turn heel or develop a real mean streak bc he is SO stale. Even when he threatened Ace he didn't seem threatening at all.

And how does Cena have a legit claim to the title? Not only was he beaten for the title fair and square BY THE OTHER CHAMPION, but he "reclaimed" the title by beating a guy who'd had a match earlier in the night.

Cena's claim to the title is the following: Him doing the right thing cost him the title (after all, he could have just let Vince screw Punk and he would have retained the belt). Also, with Punk not in the company anymore, Cena couldn't have gotten his rematch. Therefore, Cena deserved a title shot, which he got, and won the belt. Rey agreed to having the match that night. That isn't Cena's fault (just like it isn't Punk's fault that Cena didn't accept Vince's help).

It's not Cena's fault, but being the stand-up, do-the-right-thing kinda guy he's been for the last six years, I have a hard time watching him accept this title. He said that Punk beat him fair and square for the title. I also don't understand why HHH didn't make the title tournament null and void since he resigned Punk AS WWE champ. Bringing Punk back so early is prolly why I have such difficulty accepting this; if he would have stayed out for a month or so I'd understand. After just one week, though? If the champ comes back, he should still be the champ. Anybody remember what happened on SD! in 2005 during the Draft? At one point (remember: this was the one they spread out over a couple weeks) SD! didn't have the WWE or World title and they had a match to decide who would be the champion of the brand. I can't remember who won the match, but as soon as it was over, Teddy Long announced that the winner would not be the champ bc SD! now had a champion: Batista, who'd just that night been drafted. They didn't claim to have two champs, although whomever one that match has just as much of a legit claim as Cena does now.

I just don't like it; I don't buy that Cena would accept the title without beating the rightful champion. Punk is doing a good job with it, but I hope they're gonna tamper with Cena's position bc the things Punk are saying about him are absolutely true and he can't continue to be all "he's entitled to his opinion" or some weak crap like that. And the way HHH talked to him last night, he looked a bit like a bitch (he didn't stand up to HHH in ANY way).

Another thing that bugs me: I never care much about Babyfaces doing unpopular things every now and again, but Cena threatening Johnny Ace seemed VERY out of character. Kayfabe, Laurinitis was just "doing his job" and Cena always seems to respect that no matter what. But this time, after already clocking the guy, he threatens to clock him again. And I wouldn't have minded this so much if he handed almost cowered before HHH seconds later...

[cero2k]

Another thing that bugs me: I never care much about Babyfaces doing unpopular things every now and again, but Cena threatening Johnny Ace seemed VERY out of character. Kayfabe, Laurinitis was just "doing his job" and Cena always seems to respect that no matter what. But this time, after already clocking the guy, he threatens to clock him again. And I wouldn't have minded this so much if he handed almost cowered before HHH seconds later...

i was honestly expecting Ace to take the "If you touch me, i'll sue your ass" path. unfortunately he just took off

[Big Red Machine]

Again, I liked the Truth stuff; they're just being silly.

If HHH and Punk are gonna be at odds like this for a while, I WON'T miss RAW EVER AGAIN! They were solid. Cena kinda got humbled, and I think it hurt him in a way. HHH pretty much just sonned him; telling him not to call him Hunter. He needs to turn heel or develop a real mean streak bc he is SO stale. Even when he threatened Ace he didn't seem threatening at all.

And how does Cena have a legit claim to the title? Not only was he beaten for the title fair and square BY THE OTHER CHAMPION, but he "reclaimed" the title by beating a guy who'd had a match earlier in the night.

Cena's claim to the title is the following: Him doing the right thing cost him the title (after all, he could have just let Vince screw Punk and he would have retained the belt). Also, with Punk not in the company anymore, Cena couldn't have gotten his rematch. Therefore, Cena deserved a title shot, which he got, and won the belt. Rey agreed to having the match that night. That isn't Cena's fault (just like it isn't Punk's fault that Cena didn't accept Vince's help).

It's not Cena's fault, but being the stand-up, do-the-right-thing kinda guy he's been for the last six years, I have a hard time watching him accept this title. He said that Punk beat him fair and square for the title. I also don't understand why HHH didn't make the title tournament null and void since he resigned Punk AS WWE champ. Bringing Punk back so early is prolly why I have such difficulty accepting this; if he would have stayed out for a month or so I'd understand. After just one week, though? If the champ comes back, he should still be the champ. Anybody remember what happened on SD! in 2005 during the Draft? At one point (remember: this was the one they spread out over a couple weeks) SD! didn't have the WWE or World title and they had a match to decide who would be the champion of the brand. I can't remember who won the match, but as soon as it was over, Teddy Long announced that the winner would not be the champ bc SD! now had a champion: Batista, who'd just that night been drafted. They didn't claim to have two champs, although whomever one that match has just as much of a legit claim as Cena does now.

I just don't like it; I don't buy that Cena would accept the title without beating the rightful champion. Punk is doing a good job with it, but I hope they're gonna tamper with Cena's position bc the things Punk are saying about him are absolutely true and he can't continue to be all "he's entitled to his opinion" or some weak crap like that. And the way HHH talked to him last night, he looked a bit like a bitch (he didn't stand up to HHH in ANY way).

Another thing that bugs me: I never care much about Babyfaces doing unpopular things every now and again, but Cena threatening Johnny Ace seemed VERY out of character. Kayfabe, Laurinitis was just "doing his job" and Cena always seems to respect that no matter what. But this time, after already clocking the guy, he threatens to clock him again. And I wouldn't have minded this so much if he handed almost cowered before HHH seconds later...

See Kiel's post.

[badnewzxl]

See Kiel's post.

kiel's post doesn't answer anything. I understand his viewpoint, but that doesn't change what's wrong with this whole situation. John Cena's doing things out of character: why would he accept a title basically handed to him without any shame (he cleanly lost to Punk, was not featured in the WWE title tournament, and beat a guy who'd had five matches over a week while he'd only had two. Would John Cena just accept this opportunity? Or would he more likely EARN it? keep in mind what you all say about Cena ALL THE TIME. Furthermore, what about Rey's rematch? I didn't hear any plans of him getting one. I doubt they'd give him one now since they've already made the match for Summerslam. It all just seems unfair; the only way I'll understand this is if Cena becomes HHH's bitch).

And why couldn't HHH just cancel the title tournament? It was just ONE night! They didn't have the finals until the DAY PUNK RETURNED; why didn't they do the same thing they did during the 05 Draft? They already HAD a champion signed BEFORE the had the final match of the tournament. Then they give John Cena his return match THE SAME NIGHT? WHY? Why not wait til a week later like they did with the finals?

If TNA had done this, we'd all be all over their asses talking about how stupid it is. But bc it's the WWE, everyone's willing to let the crap slide. I'm not. It doesn't make much sense to me; it's like they're just trying to shoehorn Cena back into the fold and I don't see why they felt they should do it that way. Why doesn't Cena just say "Punk, you're champ. You beat me at MITB and I haven't beat you since...but I will at Summerslam" and hand his belt back over to HHH. They don't need to create this champion v. champion angle for this feud/angle; it's already a big deal....

[Styles]

See Kiel's post.

kiel's post doesn't answer anything.

that guy's post kinda answers everything dude.

[Big Red Machine]

See Kiel's post.

kiel's post doesn't answer anything. I understand his viewpoint, but that doesn't change what's wrong with this whole situation. John Cena's doing things out of character: why would he accept a title basically handed to him without any shame (he cleanly lost to Punk, was not featured in the WWE title tournament, and beat a guy who'd had five matches over a week while he'd only had two. Would John Cena just accept this opportunity? Or would he more likely EARN it? keep in mind what you all say about Cena ALL THE TIME. Furthermore, what about Rey's rematch? I didn't hear any plans of him getting one. I doubt they'd give him one now since they've already made the match for Summerslam. It all just seems unfair; the only way I'll understand this is if Cena becomes HHH's bitch).

And why couldn't HHH just cancel the title tournament? It was just ONE night! They didn't have the finals until the DAY PUNK RETURNED; why didn't they do the same thing they did during the 05 Draft? They already HAD a champion signed BEFORE the had the final match of the tournament. Then they give John Cena his return match THE SAME NIGHT? WHY? Why not wait til a week later like they did with the finals?

If TNA had done this, we'd all be all over their asses talking about how stupid it is. But bc it's the WWE, everyone's willing to let the crap slide. I'm not. It doesn't make much sense to me; it's like they're just trying to shoehorn Cena back into the fold and I don't see why they felt they should do it that way. Why doesn't Cena just say "Punk, you're champ. You beat me at MITB and I haven't beat you since...but I will at Summerslam" and hand his belt back over to HHH. They don't need to create this champion v. champion angle for this feud/angle; it's already a big deal....

You clearly haven't been paying close enough attention. Triple H said the Punk just showed up and handed him a signed contract right at the end of the Cena-Rey match. He couldn't cancel the tournament because there was no time in which to do so. As fr why they didn't wait a week to give Cena his rematch... they weren't originally going to wait for the finals, either, but Vince made them wait. There was no one in this case making them wait.

As for 2005 during that segment (I just rewatched it), Teddy Long said "Recently, I found out that there is no need for a new Smackdown champion." Depending on just how much time Teddy meant by "recently," one of the two following scenarios took place: "Recently" means "during the 6 person elimination match to crown the new champion," in which case the situation is exactly the same as it is here, or "recently" means "before the match" in which case Teddy Long lied to everyone, either maliciously, or (more kayfabe likely) to increase ratings.

Also, in that situation, Teddy Long was creating a new title, which he decided, in the end, wasn't necessary. With this situation, Cena is the recognized champion, as Vince stripped Punk of the belt. That Punk retained physical possession of the belt is irrelevant... he is not the recognized champion (much like the angle in TNA last April with Doug Williams and Kaz). Because Punk had physical possession of the belt, WWE made a new physical belt... but with the same lineage and recognition. Cena didn't just say "Punk, you are the champ" because until Triple H said so, WWE didn't recognize Punk as the champ.

Cena was also perfectly within character. He didn't come out and demand a title shot. It was given to him, and Rey agreed. I'm sure that if Rey wanted to wait a week, Cena would have been happy to wait. I'm sure you you were to ask Cena, he would say that he knows that Rey wasn't at 100%, and that after he beat Punk at Summer Slam, he will give Rey his rematch.

As for the TNA comparison- unlike most of TNA's stuff, this actually makes sense. Nothing is out of character, and no one is ignoring the blindingly obvious. They aren't trying to change or ignore established kayfabe canon, and there are no plotholes so big that you could fit a mountain of Takeshi Morishima clones in it.

[Styles]

and there are no plotholes so big that you could fit a mountain of Takeshi Morishima clones in it.

I just shit my pants at this quote. fucking hilarious

[badnewzxl]

See Kiel's post.

kiel's post doesn't answer anything.

that guy's post kinda answers everything dude.

it doesn't answer ANY of my questions; I saw what happened, I know what I'm "spose" to believe, but I don't buy it. What he's saying is true, but I just don't buy Cena accepting the title when the guy who beat him for it still has it (And Cena would def wanna beat Punk for the belt just as Punk beat him instead of being given a rematch against a guy who'd already had a match that night, two matches the show before, a ladder match at the ppv, and was one of his "good friends; I don't buy Cena not wanting to give Rey a more fair chance. And if anyone wants to suggest that HHH MADE them wrestle, think again bc he explicitly stated that he talked to both men before making the decision). Yeah he lost the title bc he did the right thing; last year he got "fired" for doing the right thing. The right thing right now would be to relinquish his WWE title and vow to beat Punk at SS. THIS IS MY POINT. IT'S JUST NOT LIKE CENA TO ACCEPT SOMETHING KNOWING IT BELONGS TO SOMEONE ELSE. Punk's claim to the title is above everyone else's bc HE WAS BACK WITH THE COMPANY BEFORE A NEW CHAMP WAS EVEN CROWNED!

I see what they're doing; I just think it's stupid and distracting from what was already a cool angle. RAW's playing up this huge deal about there being two champions instead of making it about a changing of the guard. HHH is trying to "sort out this mess" that was created seemingly for no reason, CM Punk is trying to force change in the WWE, and Cena's position is being threatened now more than ever. THAT'S ENOUGH; having them both have "legit" claims to the title is an overkill (and TOTALLY inaccurate, SINCE PUNK BEAT CENA FOR THE TITLE! And Cena, nor anyone else, beat Punk for the title. In my book, that gives Punk THE most legitimate claim and therefore he should be champion. It's not about being a CM Punk mark; it's about not being able to ignore the obvious). He was gon for ONE WEEK; let's not be ridiculous....

[Styles]

take your debating very seriously hmmm?

writing a little debate there?

got a little tasty debate?

going to debate the latest topics at full on speed?

going to keep it up until one person gets bored or the news is old?

going to get more harsh and brash to get your point across?

going to avoid all possible contradictions?

going to hopefully continue til everyone comes round to your way of thinking?

no, you probably have a full plan to end this conversation.





Back on topic. Kiel297 does have the answers, you cannot get a clearer explanation than that to be honest.

[badnewzxl]

See Kiel's post.

kiel's post doesn't answer anything. I understand his viewpoint, but that doesn't change what's wrong with this whole situation. John Cena's doing things out of character: why would he accept a title basically handed to him without any shame (he cleanly lost to Punk, was not featured in the WWE title tournament, and beat a guy who'd had five matches over a week while he'd only had two. Would John Cena just accept this opportunity? Or would he more likely EARN it? keep in mind what you all say about Cena ALL THE TIME. Furthermore, what about Rey's rematch? I didn't hear any plans of him getting one. I doubt they'd give him one now since they've already made the match for Summerslam. It all just seems unfair; the only way I'll understand this is if Cena becomes HHH's bitch).

And why couldn't HHH just cancel the title tournament? It was just ONE night! They didn't have the finals until the DAY PUNK RETURNED; why didn't they do the same thing they did during the 05 Draft? They already HAD a champion signed BEFORE the had the final match of the tournament. Then they give John Cena his return match THE SAME NIGHT? WHY? Why not wait til a week later like they did with the finals?

If TNA had done this, we'd all be all over their asses talking about how stupid it is. But bc it's the WWE, everyone's willing to let the crap slide. I'm not. It doesn't make much sense to me; it's like they're just trying to shoehorn Cena back into the fold and I don't see why they felt they should do it that way. Why doesn't Cena just say "Punk, you're champ. You beat me at MITB and I haven't beat you since...but I will at Summerslam" and hand his belt back over to HHH. They don't need to create this champion v. champion angle for this feud/angle; it's already a big deal....

You clearly haven't been paying close enough attention. Triple H said the Punk just showed up and handed him a signed contract right at the end of the Cena-Rey match. He couldn't cancel the tournament because there was no time in which to do so. As fr why they didn't wait a week to give Cena his rematch... they weren't originally going to wait for the finals, either, but Vince made them wait. There was no one in this case making them wait.

As for 2005 during that segment (I just rewatched it), Teddy Long said "Recently, I found out that there is no need for a new Smackdown champion." Depending on just how much time Teddy meant by "recently," one of the two following scenarios took place: "Recently" means "during the 6 person elimination match to crown the new champion," in which case the situation is exactly the same as it is here, or "recently" means "before the match" in which case Teddy Long lied to everyone, either maliciously, or (more kayfabe likely) to increase ratings.

Also, in that situation, Teddy Long was creating a new title, which he decided, in the end, wasn't necessary. With this situation, Cena is the recognized champion, as Vince stripped Punk of the belt. That Punk retained physical possession of the belt is irrelevant... he is not the recognized champion (much like the angle in TNA last April with Doug Williams and Kaz). Because Punk had physical possession of the belt, WWE made a new physical belt... but with the same lineage and recognition. Cena didn't just say "Punk, you are the champ" because until Triple H said so, WWE didn't recognize Punk as the champ.

Cena was also perfectly within character. He didn't come out and demand a title shot. It was given to him, and Rey agreed. I'm sure that if Rey wanted to wait a week, Cena would have been happy to wait. I'm sure you you were to ask Cena, he would say that he knows that Rey wasn't at 100%, and that after he beat Punk at Summer Slam, he will give Rey his rematch.

As for the TNA comparison- unlike most of TNA's stuff, this actually makes sense. Nothing is out of character, and no one is ignoring the blindingly obvious. They aren't trying to change or ignore established kayfabe canon, and there are no plotholes so big that you could fit a mountain of Takeshi Morishima clones in it.

I'm not complaining about Kayfabe here; I'm criticizing the choice to have two champions. Whoever's writing this angle just made it way more complicated than it needs to be and prolly too complicated get everyone over with the fans. Punk brought HHH a signed contract at the end of the show? That's the lamest thing I've ever heard and the dumbest explanation for a double champion type angle. I don't see why Punk wouldn't have just taken the contract to HHH BEFORE the finals of the tournament or AT LEAST before the Cena-Rey match so as to keep Cena from even having what little claim to the title he got from beating Rey; that's more like something he would do. Why would Punk not secure his supremacy before it could be challenged?

Your points about Teddy Long only prove mine: bc Batista was coming over, although there had been a winner of the match to crown the SD! champion, it became null and void bc they had a champ just sign. There are some slight differences in the circumstances, but this is still the same thing: There was a match/series of matches to crown a new champ and a TRUE champ came back. I think it's silly that in one instance there's just one champion and in the other there are two. But I can understand the argument that it's up to the GM/Boss's discretion.

Vince stripping Punk of the title is another thing I have a problem with; the angle would have generated WAAAY more buzz if it was still assumed that Punk was the recognized champ. They could have had the Firing of Cena and the "stripping" of CM Punk during the same segment (at the end of the show) and had HHH come out and interrupt it with the news. That way, Punk wouldn't be stripped and they could build it as a rematch for Summerslam. Have HHH become more and more frustrated having to appease Punk to get him to come back; put pressure on Cena to get the belt away from Punk; and have Punk take full advantage of and treat the McMahon's the same way he claims they treated talent from the past.

And like I said, I wouldn't mind what's going on right now so much if it happened AFTER SS at least. I understand that they had to get Punk back on tv, but if a guys only gone for a week, how can you strip him of the title? WWE knew Punk had resigned (I'm talking non-kayfabe here), why rush this angle an NOT change it so it's more believable?

I understand you all disagreeing with me, but I just don't believe what they're trying to sell me. IMO, Cena wouldn't accept the title unless he beat Punk for it nor that he would accept a match against an already tired Rey (and if you're gonna suggest that perhaps Cena was spose to get his rematch that night anyway, let me remind you that HHH announced that match in the middle of that show. Kayfabe there WASN'T gonna be a Cena rematch that night); I don't believe Punk would sign a contract AFTER MITB that didn't specify that he be THE champion (his whole point in getting the title was to have the power as top guy; why would he wait around and risk sharing it?); and I don't believe HHH in his role at all (he's talking about being fair and he puts Rey in a match with the former WWE champion the same night he fought another former champ? Why would he do that unless he was upset with Rey or favored Cena, neither of which we're spose to believe at this point). I don't know how I'm spose to take any of this.

I am intrigued to see who's gonna come out of this as the heel(s) and face(s), cuz right now any of them could turn at any moment. With the exception of the promos, the last two weeks of RAW just seem pointless; we're pretty much right where we were at the end of MITB....

[badnewzxl]

take your debating very seriously hmmm?

writing a little debate there?

got a little tasty debate?

going to debate the latest topics at full on speed?

going to keep it up until one person gets bored or the news is old?

going to get more harsh and brash to get your point across?

going to avoid all possible contradictions?

going to hopefully continue til everyone comes round to your way of thinking?

no, you probably have a full plan to end this conversation.





Back on topic. Kiel297 does have the answers, you cannot get a clearer explanation than that to be honest.

uh, yeah... that's what we do here; we debate. Sometimes we agree, sometimes we don't. We fully explain ourselves and fully express our opinions. We continue on until we have an understanding of one another, whether we disagree or not. I don't have a goal to end this conversation bc I'm just voicing MY opinion and defending MY stance; it's why you see my name in yellow. BRM, Kiel, and everyone else have their good points just as they have their likes and dislikes. We don't bicker with one another until one side concedes, we just speak our minds.

And if you can't see where I'm coming from, and you can't get through to me, why continue on in the conversation? If it's about being right or wrong to you, and you think you're right, what's there left to argue about?

And yeah, I kinda like debating with ppl; almost everyone on this forum does. It's another reason my name is in yellow this month. You've been a member for two hours; don't go acting like you know how we do it over here, jabroni....

[Styles]

take your debating very seriously hmmm?

writing a little debate there?

got a little tasty debate?

going to debate the latest topics at full on speed?

going to keep it up until one person gets bored or the news is old?

going to get more harsh and brash to get your point across?

going to avoid all possible contradictions?

going to hopefully continue til everyone comes round to your way of thinking?

no, you probably have a full plan to end this conversation.





Back on topic. Kiel297 does have the answers, you cannot get a clearer explanation than that to be honest.

uh, yeah... that's what we do here; we debate. Sometimes we agree, sometimes we don't. We fully explain ourselves and fully express our opinions. We continue on until we have an understanding of one another, whether we disagree or not. I don't have a goal to end this conversation bc I'm just voicing MY opinion and defending MY stance; it's why you see my name in yellow. BRM, Kiel, and everyone else have their good points just as they have their likes and dislikes. We don't bicker with one another until one side concedes, we just speak our minds.

And if you can't see where I'm coming from, and you can't get through to me, why continue on in the conversation? If it's about being right or wrong to you, and you think you're right, what's there left to argue about?

And yeah, I kinda like debating with ppl; almost everyone on this forum does. It's another reason my name is in yellow this month. You've been a member for two hours; don't go acting like you know how we do it over here, jabroni....

woah woah woah that's uncalled for..................jabroni? You couldn't think of a better word than that?
I know how you do it "over here" better thank you think.

I was kidding with the "debate" muck around, if you do a stewie griffin voice, you'll understand where its from.

shit. you girls are so touchy. bragging about a name being in yellow, thats like being the coolest kid in maths club.

[badnewzxl]

take your debating very seriously hmmm?

writing a little debate there?

got a little tasty debate?

going to debate the latest topics at full on speed?

going to keep it up until one person gets bored or the news is old?

going to get more harsh and brash to get your point across?

going to avoid all possible contradictions?

going to hopefully continue til everyone comes round to your way of thinking?

no, you probably have a full plan to end this conversation.





Back on topic. Kiel297 does have the answers, you cannot get a clearer explanation than that to be honest.

uh, yeah... that's what we do here; we debate. Sometimes we agree, sometimes we don't. We fully explain ourselves and fully express our opinions. We continue on until we have an understanding of one another, whether we disagree or not. I don't have a goal to end this conversation bc I'm just voicing MY opinion and defending MY stance; it's why you see my name in yellow. BRM, Kiel, and everyone else have their good points just as they have their likes and dislikes. We don't bicker with one another until one side concedes, we just speak our minds.

And if you can't see where I'm coming from, and you can't get through to me, why continue on in the conversation? If it's about being right or wrong to you, and you think you're right, what's there left to argue about?

And yeah, I kinda like debating with ppl; almost everyone on this forum does. It's another reason my name is in yellow this month. You've been a member for two hours; don't go acting like you know how we do it over here, jabroni....

woah woah woah that's uncalled for..................jabroni? You couldn't think of a better word than that?
I know how you do it "over here" better thank you think.

I was kidding with the "debate" muck around, if you do a stewie griffin voice, you'll understand where its from.

s**t. you girls are so touchy. bragging about a name being in yellow, thats like being the coolest kid in maths club.

I was great at math....

[Styles]

...i can tell

[kiel297]

Wow. I'm not even gonna bother arguing my point here, because it's clear you're too stubborn to accept it.

And Styles, what's wrong with being Member Of The Month? I was MotM once too ;D

[Styles]

There's nothing wrong with it but did ya see the brag? now that's not cool.