Promotions like ECW in particular are often described as revolutionizing the business. But did it do it for the good or the bad? Did the hardcore style of wrestling ultimately help or hurt wrestling?

I think it helped. It came along at the right time and provided a great alternative when things were getting a little stale. While it set the bar awfully high as far as 'things nobody's seen before', the industry needed that shot in the arm. The Rock n Wrestling fans were all grown up and needed some grown up entertainment.

Bob-O wrote:I think it helped. It came along at the right time and provided a great alternative when things were getting a little stale. While it set the bar awfully high as far as 'things nobody's seen before', the industry needed that shot in the arm. The Rock n Wrestling fans were all grown up and needed some grown up entertainment.

This. Without hardcore wrestling, wrestling itself wouldn't be as diversified so to speak. Sure we'd still have good matches but hardcore is an alternative. It draws in those who aren't as thrilled with a match without weapons. It's not for everybody but it's something different.

Bob-O wrote:I think it helped. It came along at the right time and provided a great alternative when things were getting a little stale. While it set the bar awfully high as far as 'things nobody's seen before', the industry needed that shot in the arm. The Rock n Wrestling fans were all grown up and needed some grown up entertainment.

what he said

Helped, at first. But taken too far (as it was for a long time in the late 90's and early 2000's) it is extremely detrimental to the business. Hardcore wrestling is a gimmick match, and it is extremely important to remember that.

Hardcore helped the business when it was something new. However, Hardcore's become its own worst enemy in the fact that the constant demand for it to go one step further played a part in its eradication from WWE, and attached brought around things like deathmatches which these days, have a stigma attached to them of being the lowest point an indie wrestler can get to (not my own views on it).

So yeah, while it brought us a whole new style of wrestling, its own need to top itself turned it into gore porn.

I recently had an interesting conversation with a few guys about this, which is why I brought it up, and after hearing them out I agree with them. Hardcore wrestling hurt the business. ECW sucked in that all the fans wanted was blood and guts. The matches taped between guys like Eddie and Dean were not the only matches that happened. Coming from Frankie Reyes, who was a referee for ECW, the fans used to boo Eddie and Dean out of the building, and that's why they left for WCW. They booed them because all they wanted was blood and gore. Hardcore wrestling is not wrestling wrestling, and when fans are just demanding blood and guts, it kills the overall art of pro wrestling. There's only so much you can do before you just start killing people in the ring every match, and most of it (while yeah some of it is actual wrestling with psychology) is just senseless beating and whipping with random shit for the sake of a pop. Remember, this is coming from a huge deathmatch fan (I enjoy it for what it is).

yourcrapsweak wrote:I recently had an interesting conversation with a few guys about this, which is why I brought it up, and after hearing them out I agree with them. Hardcore wrestling hurt the business. ECW sucked in that all the fans wanted was blood and guts. The matches taped between guys like Eddie and Dean were not the only matches that happened. Coming from Frankie Reyes, who was a referee for ECW, the fans used to boo Eddie and Dean out of the building, and that's why they left for WCW. They booed them because all they wanted was blood and gore. Hardcore wrestling is not wrestling wrestling, and when fans are just demanding blood and guts, it kills the overall art of pro wrestling. There's only so much you can do before you just start killing people in the ring every match, and most of it (while yeah some of it is actual wrestling with psychology) is just senseless beating and whipping with random s**t for the sake of a pop. Remember, this is coming from a huge deathmatch fan (I enjoy it for what it is).

Wait... this coming from the CZW fan? I've been saying things like this for years!

Death match wrestling is terrible. I dislike it for the same reasons I don't really like Puro. Too much ACTUALLY HURTING PEOPLE rather than pro-wrestling, where you PROTECT your opponent.

People seem to forget or just don't realize-"Hardcore Matches","Death-Matches" & "Street Fights" have been in wrestling for a long time now. As for ECW, I've seen plenty of matches where no weapons were involved, and the crowds had zero problem with it. The thing with them was there was no DQ's so sometimes the weapons like tables & chairs became involved later on during the matches......I don't think the idea of it hurt the business. The bastardization of it didn't help, though.

NewAgeSavior wrote:People seem to forget or just don't realize-"Hardcore Matches","Death-Matches" & "Street Fights" have been in wrestling for a long time now. As for ECW, I've seen plenty of matches where no weapons were involved, and the crowds had zero problem with it. The thing with them was there was no DQ's so sometimes the weapons like tables & chairs became involved later on during the matches......I don't think the idea of it hurt the business. The bastardization of it didn't help, though.

great points; well said.