I just want an answer to this question: If we are supposed to respect, appreciate, and admire these performers for destroying THEIR bodies for OUR enjoyment; why then should we condemn them for destroying THEIR bodies for THEIR own enjoyment?

I feel like if we're spose to love Jeff Hardy for swanton-ing off a thirty foot ladder and risking breaking his own back, but hate him bc he decides to get high afterwards; and that's a VERY bogus, backwards logic. Josh Isenburg of Wrestlezone.com has said many times on Chair Shot Reality that he doesn't have sympathy for Eddie Guerrero's passing; says he doesn't have sympathy for guys killing themselves/ruining their bodies with drugs. But he never stops to think about the toll WRESTLING took on Eddie's body. I just don't get this idea that someone like Misawa deserves honor bc he died putting on a show for the fans, while Jeff Hardy deserves malice for doing something HE enjoys for HIMSELF. Hell, you can kill your damn family and still be considered a great but if you smoke mad blunts it somehow hurts the business? C'mon....

badnewzxl wrote:I just want an answer to this question: If we are supposed to respect, appreciate, and admire these performers for destroying THEIR bodies for OUR enjoyment; why then should we condemn them for destroying THEIR bodies for THEIR own enjoyment?

the true answer is because we're biased. No one says anything about RVD smoking a joint, but Hardy should go to hell for doing whatever he does. In all honesty, we shouldn't even care if they're alcoholic or drug addicts.

However, there are two points that i would like to make.

1. Every wrestler is a public figure. Kids look up to them, hell even grown ups sometimes look up to some wrestler because of who they represent on TV. I'm pretty sure CM Punk has been the inspiration of many to become Straightedge, as well, RVD probably was the inspiration to smoke pot back in the philly days. I'm not a father, but if I knew my son/daughter was idolizing a guy that was two years in court for having drugs (and lots of them) or a guy that shoots a video on youtube that "it's his goodbye" and my daughter comes crying saying that his favorite wrestler is about to commit suicide, i'm sure as hell gonna dislike this person, and will condemn them. This may be extreme, but look at Jeff Hardy's vs Punk feud back in WWE. Punk is preaching to the people to not smoke, drink, or do drugs. Out comes Jeff Hardy and tells them, with frutty colors and cool looking rags, "i'm a free spirit, i can do what ever i want, who are you to tell me what to do". I don't have a kid, and yet I hated every mother/father that didn't tell their kids, you know, you should rather cheer for this guy CM Punk, he makes a good case.

2. Again, we shouldn't care if a wrestler consumes drugs, but if such wrestler comes to the ring drunk/high and botches the match, i'm in all freedom to bash on them. I'm not gonna say "cuz of the safety of the other wrestler" screw that, yesterday i saw Rhett Titus almost reach 1.0 Muta and never worried about his health. But there has been many occasions that a wrestler comes out completely out and screw a match (Hardy, Hall, Snake). As a paying fan, i'm gonna get pissed if I payed to see Hardy vs Sting and only get a 2 min match with Hardy barely able to stand. If I pay to see a Scott Hall return match, i wanna see a Scott Hall return match, not a Scott hall walks to the ring,can't get inside, decides to leave match. It's like in music, if you pay for a concert, you wanna hear the songs, but if the singer comes out all lost, and can't play a single song, the show is gonna be shitty and you'll dislike it, and you've been waiting for this show and payed for it. You're entitled to bash on the singer.

cero2k wrote:2. Again, we shouldn't care if a wrestler consumes drugs, but if such wrestler comes to the ring drunk/high and botches the match, i'm in all freedom to bash on them. I'm not gonna say "cuz of the safety of the other wrestler" screw that, yesterday i saw Rhett Titus almost reach 1.0 Muta and never worried about his health. But there has been many occasions that a wrestler comes out completely out and screw a match (Hardy, Hall, Snake). As a paying fan, i'm gonna get pissed if I payed to see Hardy vs Sting and only get a 2 min match with Hardy barely able to stand. If I pay to see a Scott Hall return match, i wanna see a Scott Hall return match, not a Scott hall walks to the ring,can't get inside, decides to leave match. It's like in music, if you pay for a concert, you wanna hear the songs, but if the singer comes out all lost, and can't play a single song, the show is gonna be shitty and you'll dislike it, and you've been waiting for this show and payed for it. You're entitled to bash on the singer.

Very much this. I honestly don't care what someone does outside the ring, they can drink themselves stupid every night and day or get high, do lines, shoot up, whatever. But if you show up for a show messed up, i will not be pleased as a fan. I either tune in or go to show expecting something but then get nothing because the guy decided to disrespect the fans? Thats why i've never been much of a Scott Hall fan either, he was alright in the ring but i became tired of him no showing events and showing up intoxicated. They can ruin their bodies and minds as much as they want but i find it to be an insult to myself and fellow fans if they show up intoxicated.

Rabid619 wrote:

cero2k wrote:2. Again, we shouldn't care if a wrestler consumes drugs, but if such wrestler comes to the ring drunk/high and botches the match, i'm in all freedom to bash on them. I'm not gonna say "cuz of the safety of the other wrestler" screw that, yesterday i saw Rhett Titus almost reach 1.0 Muta and never worried about his health. But there has been many occasions that a wrestler comes out completely out and screw a match (Hardy, Hall, Snake). As a paying fan, i'm gonna get pissed if I payed to see Hardy vs Sting and only get a 2 min match with Hardy barely able to stand. If I pay to see a Scott Hall return match, i wanna see a Scott Hall return match, not a Scott hall walks to the ring,can't get inside, decides to leave match. It's like in music, if you pay for a concert, you wanna hear the songs, but if the singer comes out all lost, and can't play a single song, the show is gonna be shitty and you'll dislike it, and you've been waiting for this show and payed for it. You're entitled to bash on the singer.

Very much this. I honestly don't care what someone does outside the ring, they can drink themselves stupid every night and day or get high, do lines, shoot up, whatever. But if you show up for a show messed up, i will not be pleased as a fan. I either tune in or go to show expecting something but then get nothing because the guy decided to disrespect the fans? Thats why i've never been much of a Scott Hall fan either, he was alright in the ring but i became tired of him no showing events and showing up intoxicated. They can ruin their bodies and minds as much as they want but i find it to be an insult to myself and fellow fans if they show up intoxicated.

I agree with Rabid and also feel the need to add the following. If a wrestler does something illegal people have a right to lose respect for him/her. It's not just drugs. Look at Nick Gage.

thank you guys for giving me answers that aren't 100% bullshit.

What made me think of this topic was (obviously) all the Matt Hardy topics and some of the bullshit Josh Isenburg has said on Chair shot Reality. The idea tht someone is a saint for beating themselves up so we fans can be entertained, but they are a piece of shit for getting high in their spare time has always bothered me. The Matt Hardy bs is the most relevant example; all these ppl are dissing on him for "throwing his life away" and "destroying his body with drugs" only bc him doing so means he's less likely to be able to put his life in jeopardy and destroy his body in the ring; for our entertainment.

that just screams hypocrisy to me....

I frown upon it because it is ILLEGAL!

I don't care if they drink, I do it

I don't care if they smoke tobacco, I don't but its legal.

Things like weed, meth, LSD, 'shrooms WHATEVER, its illegal therefore, In my opinion wrong.

I'm a firm believer in upholding the law when it comes to substances.

Big Red Machine wrote:

Rabid619 wrote:

cero2k wrote:2. Again, we shouldn't care if a wrestler consumes drugs, but if such wrestler comes to the ring drunk/high and botches the match, i'm in all freedom to bash on them. I'm not gonna say "cuz of the safety of the other wrestler" screw that, yesterday i saw Rhett Titus almost reach 1.0 Muta and never worried about his health. But there has been many occasions that a wrestler comes out completely out and screw a match (Hardy, Hall, Snake). As a paying fan, i'm gonna get pissed if I payed to see Hardy vs Sting and only get a 2 min match with Hardy barely able to stand. If I pay to see a Scott Hall return match, i wanna see a Scott Hall return match, not a Scott hall walks to the ring,can't get inside, decides to leave match. It's like in music, if you pay for a concert, you wanna hear the songs, but if the singer comes out all lost, and can't play a single song, the show is gonna be shitty and you'll dislike it, and you've been waiting for this show and payed for it. You're entitled to bash on the singer.

Very much this. I honestly don't care what someone does outside the ring, they can drink themselves stupid every night and day or get high, do lines, shoot up, whatever. But if you show up for a show messed up, i will not be pleased as a fan. I either tune in or go to show expecting something but then get nothing because the guy decided to disrespect the fans? Thats why i've never been much of a Scott Hall fan either, he was alright in the ring but i became tired of him no showing events and showing up intoxicated. They can ruin their bodies and minds as much as they want but i find it to be an insult to myself and fellow fans if they show up intoxicated.

I agree with Rabid and also feel the need to add the following. If a wrestler does something illegal people have a right to lose respect for him/her. It's not just drugs. Look at Nick Gage.

This. Nick Gage foes pretty much unspoken about these days, nobody wants anything to do with that.

Earth Child wrote:I frown upon it because it is ILLEGAL!

I don't care if they drink, I do it

I don't care if they smoke tobacco, I don't but its legal.

Things like weed, meth, LSD, 'shrooms WHATEVER, its illegal therefore, In my opinion wrong.

I'm a firm believer in upholding the law when it comes to substances.

I totally disagree with you; but I totally understand you as well. THANK YOU for sharing your thoughts. When I was in college I had several intense conversations with a girl I really liked and whom really liked me and we never got together bc we disagreed the very same way. I feel like I should be able to do whatever I want with my own body; esp if I can get tats and piercings and jump off a twenty foot ladder; she didn't think so, and I can understand that.

Big Red Machine wrote:

Rabid619 wrote:

cero2k wrote:2. Again, we shouldn't care if a wrestler consumes drugs, but if such wrestler comes to the ring drunk/high and botches the match, i'm in all freedom to bash on them. I'm not gonna say "cuz of the safety of the other wrestler" screw that, yesterday i saw Rhett Titus almost reach 1.0 Muta and never worried about his health. But there has been many occasions that a wrestler comes out completely out and screw a match (Hardy, Hall, Snake). As a paying fan, i'm gonna get pissed if I payed to see Hardy vs Sting and only get a 2 min match with Hardy barely able to stand. If I pay to see a Scott Hall return match, i wanna see a Scott Hall return match, not a Scott hall walks to the ring,can't get inside, decides to leave match. It's like in music, if you pay for a concert, you wanna hear the songs, but if the singer comes out all lost, and can't play a single song, the show is gonna be shitty and you'll dislike it, and you've been waiting for this show and payed for it. You're entitled to bash on the singer.

Very much this. I honestly don't care what someone does outside the ring, they can drink themselves stupid every night and day or get high, do lines, shoot up, whatever. But if you show up for a show messed up, i will not be pleased as a fan. I either tune in or go to show expecting something but then get nothing because the guy decided to disrespect the fans? Thats why i've never been much of a Scott Hall fan either, he was alright in the ring but i became tired of him no showing events and showing up intoxicated. They can ruin their bodies and minds as much as they want but i find it to be an insult to myself and fellow fans if they show up intoxicated.

I agree with Rabid and also feel the need to add the following. If a wrestler does something illegal people have a right to lose respect for him/her. It's not just drugs. Look at Nick Gage.

I understand the whole Nick Gage thing; he committed a VIOLENT crime (robbery); my beef comes when someone gets shit for doing harm to themselves for their own enjoyment. I'm totally on board when it comes to Nick Gage robbing a bank or Jeff Hardy coming out at VR all fucked up; but Matt Hardy being high and/or making a youtube vid about ghosts is not at all a cry for help, imo.